[music]. My brother, so good to see you. Sure, yeah, you've been. I'm good. How you doing? I'm doing great, looking good. Good, you're looking fit. Yeah, come on in. First of all, I want to thank you for stopping by while you're in town, and this is a once-in-a-lifetime experience for anybody to actually have a one-on-one conversation with you about the principles. And I met you at the Forbes 100 greatest business minds, which I was, you know, was just so honored to be there, and I'm thankful that my last name ends in a C and yours ends in a D, because that's how we met. We were right, I was in front of you, for we were gonna go steak to take the big picture, and and I wanted to ask you a couple of questions straight from the things I highlighted in the book. First thing was: but what's your definition of radically open-minded? Is to simultaneously have an opinion, like, like, let me give you this, but you think it should go this way. Yes, and then you say to yourself: how do I know? I'm right, maybe that's wrong. Is that as good as I can be? And then the capacity to hear and then challenge. So somebody comes up to you with an idea and says, okay, let's do this. What do you think about that? To harvest the best around you, but sorting it with your own mind. So I say to be open-minded and assertive at the same time. Don't give up your assertiveness. But to be curious, like am i harvesting the best? Because the biggest thing that most people have their problem is they get so opinionated that they can't take in.
And the worst problem is the worst tragedy of man kind- almost any individual- is that they're attached to pinions that are wrong and they don't want to have them stress tested. So when your Oakley open-minded, you can say, hey, man, I really think it should go this way, and then, at the same time, say to the smartest people that you know, kick the [ __ ] out of it and tried to say, okay, now let's see how the stress tests, so that I can then go to the best or how I harvest.
This is gonna be very important for you to get your leverage okay, because you want to go to this new high level right and you want to do a lot of things, and in order to do the lot of things, you're gonna have to get the most leverage of other people, but you also want it to be great blood, just like you want it to, because you've got a unique ability, with your taste and everything, to be able to make those choices. So you know what's great and what's not great. So in order to go from that, you have to pick the people who can do that, who can deliver with you, what you could do, to find people who are as good or better than you and then to get that leverage.
The key is to try to find out what you're not good at. Okay, write those things down that you're not good at, and then you get the people who are good at those things and then you get the great leverage right. So you know, think what are you not good at and get that great leverage and then get the sympatico even on the things you're good at.
That's great. And as as I'm, as I'm building up my leverage and and- and I'm, you know, building my team, what advice would you give me on how to find the best in class? But the first thing you need to do for each job is to have a spec sheets. You know the specifications for that job. Think about what are the most essential elements for each job, because each job requires a different kind of talent. Okay, now just go ahead- is we live in a time where people know how to give really good interviews.
So as I've been building, I've been fooled a couple of times. I right now a very detailed spec sheet. They may say they understand it, but then when an a, he had given me the appearance that that that they understand the job and they do a stellar interview. But then you know when we, with three months into it, into the trench, yeah, I don't think. Yeah, here's the deal. What you do is you use the personality profile, testing, background checks and the resume, and I do a thing which called reverse 360, so to find out not just their resumes, but to find out everybody who knew them in the past, and then you go and do the checking. So you have to start with a spec sheet, meaning not just the skills. There were three things that everybody brings you. Skills is what almost everybody hires for. It's the least important of the three things. The most important things are values, abilities and skills. So first, what are their values?
Because if you're not values aligned, you're gonna have a problem like: how are you gonna be with each other? The second thing is then abilities, like like some people, like you, a very creative thinker, somebody may be very reliable, they're not creative. The each person has a natural ability and abilities that they've gone to develop. Those are the things that make you excel or, worse, bad at things. And then you have skills, and skills is like a: you know, okay, you can play the piano or you can sing or you could do that. So each Bert that's learned. But if you start to look at, okay, what are the person's values? Where's that coming from? What were you gonna have Sympatico? Because at that deep level you have to have that simpatico. You're on a mission together, it's not just a job right.
And then their ability. So you got to get the spec sheet right. Once you know the language and you've got it down, then they come and they meet you and then you, you do those kind of write tests and then you and then view when, when you're starting with them, that the tests don't end okay, because you're you're testing them every single day and it's how you do that and even being able to rely on others to even make those selections for you.
You know, sometimes, because I've done this, I will look at those particular results and I can say, okay, that's that type of person and, as that type of person, a good click with the job. I feel like I need a hard reset. I feel like I've been this computer that's been going and going and going and going and going nonstop. I know you split things up into personal and business principles, but for somebody that's coming from a history of success, what advice would you give for that for me, on knowing how it starts to chip away at your confidence a little bit and and how?
You know, what steps did you take to reset and get up out of that and get to a point where you started to flourish in life and became like the greatest that you can be. Is it just like? You know, paying those reflection equals progress. You're you. You had the crash. You have the experience. That's part of the self-discovery. Like, what do you want right now? Yes, you're at a juncture. What really matters to you? Yes, right, yes, because you're talking about excellence. Yes, okay, you're talking about keeping the bar high. Yes, so let's talk about how you keep the bar high with that determination and then simultaneously deal with people who may not have that bar high, because that's what I'm hearing you. Yes, okay, exactly, that's, that's that deal, okay. So now I want to go and understand and explore that okay, how you keep the bar high and then also get with them, okay, cuz you gotta sort them and some people go on to jump, as I something don't want it, but I want to know how you don't tell you - how are you doing on that man?
I'm gonna tell you the truth, like I had to step away from the game because it it got to a point where where I didn't feel like I was playing with players of my caliber and I felt like I was investing so much time in the now and in the, the art piece of it that, you know, when it came time, you know, for my investment in my future as far as is my business team and the team of executives around me, you know, it kind of got away from me. I got to a point where I was having so much success in so many different areas and so I wasn't paying attention to making sure that the, that I was still nurturing the team. And then, when I had to come back off a tour and I had to get back in the business mode, you know, I realized that. You know I had outgrew. My team wasn't like they were bad, it's just that they weren't at the level of excellence that I was at. That that level of excellence is very, very hard for me. What's interesting to me is I've seen this happen over and over again with all different people and I've we've had conversations with people who run great sports teams, people who run great teams in any way, and have that element of excellence and and how to do that. So you, absolutely you're not gonna compromise the excellence. You shouldn't, yes, and so on at the same time, like, how do you get the path?
Just find somebody who's really great at delivering that and make them a good partner. So, whether it's terrors or some buddy there who says I'm making it my job to deliver those types of people to you, yes, yes, okay, because you you're not going to do this, the sell yourself wall, and you may not even be the best person to know how to do it, because you gotta get organizing to the test and you gotta administer and whatever it is.
I think that's what I'm trying to confess. Is that that's? That's something I'm not good at. I don't. I don't think that you know I'm good at that. I think there's something you better get liberated. Once you get it and once you're doing it, it is a kick because you do, because, like you say, you're hitting, you're stretching up to that level and then you're, if you don't have great talent around you first of all, it's not a kick, it's a pain, it's miserable, because then you know you're just slogging along and what was the kick, the kick, the fun, or the fun, okay, the fun, the joy, okay, it is a blast be around great people. Yeah, it is a downer to have people who can't play, though that's what I'm saying - okay, so I'm saying it's a kick, like whether, if somebody's my dad was a jazz musician, so I think of jazz, you know, and I think like, wow, great jazz musicians. I listen to great Jeff whoo and I listen to that and I say wow, okay. Or a baked great basketball team or any other group of people to play that basketball you use that exist example. To play that around is a kick, okay, and it's. And it drags you down if you can't do that. But in order to do that, well, whatever you want in your life, you have to ask who is going to be able to, capable of giving it to me because so it's an assignment to somebody who is going to be talented and knows how to produce and deliver talent, like, if you think of it, just you're. If you're running a team doesn't mean you're gonna groan around and do all that talent finding and talent sorting or whatever, so you're gonna be the captain of the team. And then somebody out there is gonna say: I know how to Scout, I know how to test, I know how to do it. You tell me what? Who's playing good basketball with you? Let me put this one on the court.
How do you find him? Okay? No, no, you don't like that. Let me recalibrate, cuz it's my mission. The guy next to you is your talent guy. It's my mission to deliver those stars. When you start to realize that you don't have to do everything yourself, okay, whatever impediments you have, you can get the best talent in the world to do that with you and it doesn't take any real time, it doesn't cost you hardly anything relative to the cost of wasting your time trying to not get those right people on there. And then you go and you and you refine the process, but don't let yourself be the guy who's now gonna undertake this mission and undertake that mission and undertake that mission, okay, yes, okay, yes, you got your talent scout, you play okay.
That's the definition of a mentor-mentee relationship. I connected with me. You know, I have my marching orders, I know what to do with that. Yeah, thank you for that. And then we're gonna. And then we're gonna look, yeah, okay, how you doing it. Yeah, because I'm saying success is a five-step process. First you have to know what you're going after, your goals. Then you encounter your problems. Number two: you encounter your problems on the way to your goals. Then you have to diagnose those problems and get at the root causes of those problems. And that might be a weakness that you have or a weakness that somebody has, but you better get at the root cause. And then, once you got the root cause, then you can design something you write down on your to-do list.
I got to do this thing. That's number four: design. And then number five: you got to do it. Yes, you just can't say, okay, now I'm gonna do that thing and not push through the results. And if you could do that over and over, that's a formula for success. You only have to do those five things. You got the formula for success, and so, but not everybody's good at all of those steps.
So it's okay, you don't have to be good at everything. You just have to find the right people who are good. We're not good, and then you go through that last thing in that day that I wanted to ask you is who are some of the leaders that you look up to, and why? One guy comes to mind is Muhammad Yunus. Muhammad Yunus is the man who invented microfinance and is changing Jeff Canada, Geoff Canada, Harlem Children's Zone.
Yes, yeah, okay, he's a shaper. Yeah, yeah, he's a shaper and he can make it any disruptor and a disruptor and a smart good, yeah. So Jeff Canada is, is is one of those. And let me say something else also. We're at a time where is it great to be successful?
Is it great to be a millionaire? Is it great to be a billionaire? Yes, okay, we want to convey those things to people. You can have character at any level of operating. So the people that I admire the most are these people who you know. They have the great character and and they're giving to other people. Those are the people, but they're so. A lot of names come to mind when you're asking me questions, and so here's the book principles for everyone that hasn't read the book yet. You explain why you wrote the book and I think the why is employed. You know for people to know that, having read it. So can you explain to me one more time why you wrote this book and why it's so important to your legacy?
I think there are three phases in one's life. The first phase is you're dependent on others in your learning. Then you graduate, then you go in the second phase of your life and increasingly people are dependent on you and you're working and you're trying to be successful. I'm in transition from the end of that phase to the next phase in my life and the most important thing for me is to help other people be successful. I learned along the way certain things that helped me be successful. So whatever success I've had has not been because of me. It's because of principles that I learn along the way. But you know you have a collection kind of late in life and you want to pass. So I wanted to pass those along to be able to. You know I'm at the stage in my life. Yeah, I'm 70 years old. Yeah, I want to pass along what's been good for me. So that's what I want to do, and then when I do that, I can have peace. So when I look at it and and I know like what the it reverberates, not only helping you, because it's such an important thing to be not only helping you, but to help the others, that you're trying to help- it reverberates and I feel good, like I will have done what I did you should, that I have, and then I'll have peace.
Yes, okay, that's peace, and then I could save her life. Yeah, play around with my grandkids and I do all the things that I'm still excited about. So that's why- and that's and that's the most important part out of all this- is to get to that peace. I want to.
I don't want to make the most money, I want to be known for giving the most money away. I'm known as this man called Mansa Musa. It's a part of our history. He was African King and the richest man in the world- and the, the changes that he made, the way he would go into the communities and in Africa and and- and I'm talking about like the, the way he would just help the underserved and underprivileged- he's a big hero of mine.
I'ma send you some information on man, Mansa Musa, role models- models are good and I'm very interested, but it becomes the natural arc. It's instinctual that what happens is but like, look, you didn't have anything, I didn't have anything. And then you go the arc and you acquire stuff and then, okay, and then also people go through. Is it status, is it proven things and all of that. You get past all that, whatever it is. Is it the craft and all of that, and then you feel secure and it doesn't doesn't take much past a certain point to have more than you feel secure. And then you start to feel empathy, you start to relate, you start to see in Justices, you start to see these other things happen and you can do that, and it starts to bring joy. And then you're gonna be going, you're, you're gonna be passing those things and what can you pass? And so it becomes the joys change from going to nothing to making a lot and realizing what's it gonna get you more really. And the irony of it is I never really worked for money. There was an irony that's so crazy. I've never worked for money. Neither is that funny thing is for me. Maybe it's been the same for you. I ended up playing a game that I liked and got good at, and then they and they gave me money. If you good at the game, they give you money. Exactly, okay, that's what it is now. I think that's a very, very important part of people that are successful. People don't realize that most people that are successful and you know earn a lot of money. They're really just doing their jobs extremely, extremely well and that is a benefit of it. It's just, and then it becomes something that you can use to help other people, because there's but so much stuff you could buy, you know. And then it becomes, you know, it becomes what you know it should be used for for us to, to help each other and to and to make positive changes. That's right. So when I look at that and I say, okay, now I'm at a, let's say, you get the money and whatever comes in and you can get this thing, or you can get a kid through high school and into a job like your school, yes, and then you know what makes you feel better. Okay, you have to do with what makes you feel better for me, like- and I relate, cuz you relate because you went through it- yes, and so it's natural.
Yes, it's natural, so that our life arc. Sometimes we lose sight of that. Yes, because people are thinking that the person who's made a lot of money is trying to make a lot of money or exploiting Yentl or something, rather than they're just producing things that people like and the people that are paying for the things that they like. So that's a good symbiotic relationship. Then you take the money and you do good things with it. That's the deal. Yes, yes, definitely. I want to thank you for this vote right here as an entrepreneur, and I will say to all entrepreneurs out there that this is required reading. And you know- also- thank you for just you know- all the books that that that you've given me to give, to give away to you know people in the community that may not be able to afford it, and and given them and it's such a blessing.
So I I want everybody to know how pure this relationship is, and you know this. This is the. The only ulterior motive that we have is to empower people through the information of your journey and all the things that you've learned, which we all have to go through, as being successful entrepreneurs. So it's official right now: principals is required reading. If you are becoming an entrepreneur. You're an entrepreneur, doesn't matter if you're 8 to 80, you know it doesn't matter. You could always, never too late to start, but you know this is a book that will will take some years off of your life. I feel as you as an entrepreneur, and you know it's been something that has come to me as a blessing, because, you know, when I read it the first time, I was at a at a certain point of my life.
But then, at this point where now I'm like my second mountain and I'm at a point where, where I want to be the best, I can be an understanding the process, this, this right here, has given me the roadmap. So I'm going to just thank you. Let me tell you I'm a great admirer of you because you got what it takes. Thanks, really, thanks. Not, I'm not been firing for you for your success. Yeah, I'm admiring you for the type of person you are, and so, for me, the ability to pass along things that are helpful and know that you're also gonna pass along the things that are helpful to you, yeah, it's joy. Thank you for the joy, and I cannot let you leave without giving me an autographed copy. Okay, okay, we don't. Can we get a round of applause for Ray Dalio [Music] you?